A return to podcasts

Plus, STRAIGHT SHOOT talk and musings on what makes a podcast great

First and foremost, if you haven’t listened to the latest episode of Oliver Bateman Does the Work, remedy that forthrightly below; make sure to scroll down for his insightful annotations.

The Work of Comics, Part 2

I had a great time chatting with Oliver, as I always do, and it got me thinking about what exactly it is that makes a podcast good and worthwhile. It’s a pertinent subject for me as, with a fast-approaching new book announcement,¹ I’m anticipating once again running the podcast gauntlet.

Those who have been with me a minute will recall that I used to run my own podcast, The World’s Smartest Rasslin’ Talk Show, STRAIGHT SHOOT.² From some very rough early outings, STRAIGHT SHOOT grew into the most successful independently operated wrestling podcast on the planet, leading directly to Penguin Random House³ asking me to do The Comic Book Story of Professional Wrestling. All of which is to say: I have definite opinions about what makes a good podcast.

A good podcast needs to be an active, engaging discussion, as my recent one with Oliver certainly was. I think often of Plato’s distinction between rhetoric and discourse; the former is used to communicate, convince or cajole while the latter is a method for two or more people to discover truth together. While podcasts naturally trend toward conversational tones, there has to be an end destination, even if the participants don’t initially know where they’re headed.

This was certainly the case when Oliver and I spoke this past week. He’s an exceptionally bright, well-informed guy and a great talker, so it’s unsurprising that our conversation winded and wended across a dozen tangents. But Oliver’s steady hand kept us moving forward, such that even I was surprised with where we ended up, including drawing favorable comparisons between Vince McMahon and Dave Sim and referencing Wassily Kandinsky⁴ on two distinct occasions, which are both hopefully not wholly insufferable.

But just having a good conversation – even one that ends up somewhere surprising and enlightening – isn’t sufficient for a podcast to be truly excellent, especially when there are guests involved. It seems obvious to say but: Podcasts need to spotlight their guests. This is true from a content perspective and delivering what the audience expects as well as from a practical standpoint. Doing STRAIGHT SHOOT, my goal was always to tee my guests up to sound brilliant, which is why so many actual, working, world-renown wrestlers did my show, along with writers, artists, comedians and rock stars.⁵

Oliver gets that when his guests sound good, so does he and, accordingly, the man lobbed softballs for me to absolutely crush out of the park. To wit, the podcast kicks off with and repeatedly returns to discussion of Cerebus.⁶ What’s more, while staying continually engaged, Oliver was also considerate enough to stand back and let me go when I started clambering up on my soapbox, such as when discussing fundamental attributes of comics as a medium.

Finally, while they can be a lot of fun for the people doing them, if a podcast is to be taken seriously it also has to be work. Wholly unsurprisingly: Oliver Bateman Does the Work. Whenever I talk to Oliver, I’m shocked by his familiarity not just with my oeuvre in comics and elsewhere, but by how well-informed he is about whatever my bugaboos are at a given time, e.g., Cerebus. The man does his research, which is yet another of my bugaboos discussed in the podcast.

Additionally – and as I mentioned earlier – Oliver provides with his podcast something that should become industry standard:⁷ Thoughtful annotations including additional insights, helpful context and further reading. In addition to enticing listeners with some quick teases, the annotations also serve as a helpful recap for those who listened on the go, providing reminders of what was discussed and ways to learn more and further engage.

If you’re a long-time Aubrey supporter, I hope you’ll check out my appearance on Oliver Bateman Does the Work; I truly think it’ll scratch that STRAIGHT SHOOT phantom limb. And, if you’re a newer subscriber, there’s a decent chance you’ve never heard me cut loose for an hour of expositing, bold claims and rambling until I get somewhere interesting. What better time to change that?

It’s been a while since I did any podcasts and, as I mentioned up top, I’m anticipating doing quite a few this year. So I’m extremely grateful for Oliver providing me the opportunity to knock off some ring rust. Now that I’m getting back up to speed, if you have a truly great podcast or interview series – especially on Substack – and are looking for guests, please reply with a link or drop it in the comments!

Thanks, as always, for reading, subscribing, liking, commenting and sharing; with the hollowing out of traditional media, web media and now social media as well, a newsletter is many creators’ best option for reaching their audience.

NEXT WEEK: I discuss comics’ lack of a critical body of work and the resulting impacts. Unless something else comes up or I change my mind.

Aubrey

1. Stay tuned. If I’m making you ache for it, that’s the idea.

2. Sorry, it’s no longer available anywhere. Cue “Leave the Memories Alone” video package.

3. Via the incredible Patrick Barb, then at the Ten Speed Press imprint.

4. Specifically his Concerning the Spiritual in Art, as recommended to me by the incredible cartoonist Max Fuchs.

5. Cody Rhodes, Adam Cole, Roderick Strong, Tommaso Ciampa, Juice Robinson, Shayna Baszler, Matt Hardy, Maria Bennett, Andy Williams (Every Time I Die and the Butcher) Land Phil Hall (Municipal Waste), Alex Levine (Gaslight Anthem), Ron Funches, Jason Aaron, Dennis Hopeless, Sean O’Connor, etc.

6. Including an art/artist separation discussion that is especially relevant this week.

7. Perhaps you’ve noticed that I’m endeavoring to do my part in this regard!